Hi Emmy
thanks for the additional info. You had it right, it's Vincenzo Risi born 1886, father Lorenzo Antonio and mother Gertruda Fusco. I think he was born in Portella which I believe is part of the Sant'Elia comune so I guess his records would be on the Sant'Elia film if they are anywhere.
Gertruda Fusco (married name Risi) may have died in 1882 but this is only a long shot.
Will speak to again after the holiday. PS my local FHC phoned today and the films I ordered for Cassino have arrived. Unfortunately i don't have time to visit today so will have to look at them when I get back. Hopefuly I may find Gertrulda and Lorenzo's birth records there.
Millybobs
Risi and Fusco families
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Hi all.
Well I had a great holiday in Italy, during which I spent a couple of days in Cassino and Sant'Elia Fiumerapido (Frosinone, Lazio). Although everyone was really helpful in the record offices in the comune town halls in both these places, I wasn't able to locate any relevant family records in the short time I was there. Nevertheless, it was great to see the places my ancestors knew all those years ago.
I have been successful, though, in locating the Atto di Nascita for my great grandfather in the LDS microfilm library at my local FHC. He was born in 1850, and although his father is given as 'padre incerto' at least I have his mother's name and age and can now start to look for her records.
The document has a handwritten note recording the subject’s later marriage. Could anyone confirm please precisely what this says?
Hope the above link works. It's the first time I've used Imageshack.
Paul
Well I had a great holiday in Italy, during which I spent a couple of days in Cassino and Sant'Elia Fiumerapido (Frosinone, Lazio). Although everyone was really helpful in the record offices in the comune town halls in both these places, I wasn't able to locate any relevant family records in the short time I was there. Nevertheless, it was great to see the places my ancestors knew all those years ago.
I have been successful, though, in locating the Atto di Nascita for my great grandfather in the LDS microfilm library at my local FHC. He was born in 1850, and although his father is given as 'padre incerto' at least I have his mother's name and age and can now start to look for her records.
The document has a handwritten note recording the subject’s later marriage. Could anyone confirm please precisely what this says?
Hope the above link works. It's the first time I've used Imageshack.
Paul
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Hi Paul just hope someone else will check this out.
A di 1 Janaio 1873 ?..Rollo ...? in di Capino? (Cassino?)
ha sposato Lorenzo ? Risi con Getrude Fusco fu Domenicantonio di S'Elia
Caserta 2nd Gunio 1876
Signature of person recording the entry
On 1st January 1873 ? in Cassino was married Lorenzo Risi? with Gertrude Fusco -maybe I'm wrong with the next part - but could Domenicantonio from Sant'Elia be Gertrude's father? the 'fu' means he was dead when this marriage took place.
The next date is when this entry was recorded.
As I said I'm not sure this is correct.
Emmy
A di 1 Janaio 1873 ?..Rollo ...? in di Capino? (Cassino?)
ha sposato Lorenzo ? Risi con Getrude Fusco fu Domenicantonio di S'Elia
Caserta 2nd Gunio 1876
Signature of person recording the entry
On 1st January 1873 ? in Cassino was married Lorenzo Risi? with Gertrude Fusco -maybe I'm wrong with the next part - but could Domenicantonio from Sant'Elia be Gertrude's father? the 'fu' means he was dead when this marriage took place.
The next date is when this entry was recorded.
As I said I'm not sure this is correct.
Emmy
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Fu after a woman's name usually means that she was is a widow. The name that follows " fu" is her former husband's last name.
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Many Thanks Sirena I wasnt sure what that meant all I did know that Domenicantonio was dead when the marriage took place.
Paul I wont know for certain until tomorrow when I go to the FHC but just now, when I was recording the index for deaths in 1863 in Sant'Elia there is an entry for Domenico Antonio Fusco I'll check out the actual record tomorrow and let you know what it says.
Emmy
ps Just checked Information I had posted on page1 and it seems that DomenicAntonio was 28 years old when he died I'll check again tomorrow to find out if it says anything about him having been married.
Paul I wont know for certain until tomorrow when I go to the FHC but just now, when I was recording the index for deaths in 1863 in Sant'Elia there is an entry for Domenico Antonio Fusco I'll check out the actual record tomorrow and let you know what it says.
Emmy
ps Just checked Information I had posted on page1 and it seems that DomenicAntonio was 28 years old when he died I'll check again tomorrow to find out if it says anything about him having been married.
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Thanks Sirena and Emmy for your help. So it seems like Geltrude Fusco was the widow of Domenicantonio Fusco of Sant'Elia when she married Lorenzo Risi in Cassino in 1873.
Looks like I need to order the marriage records microfilm for that year for Cassino. I wonder if that will give me Geltrude's maiden name?
Paul
Looks like I need to order the marriage records microfilm for that year for Cassino. I wonder if that will give me Geltrude's maiden name?
Paul
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Would someone please check the name after the 'fu'
at the end of the birth act I know it says Domenic antonio could the next part be his surname ? and not S'Elia (Sant'Elia)as I thought.
Any Ideas?
Emmy
at the end of the birth act I know it says Domenic antonio could the next part be his surname ? and not S'Elia (Sant'Elia)as I thought.
Any Ideas?
Emmy
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Paul I'm sure Fusco would have been Gertruda's maiden name.
Even after a woman gets married, eg on ships manifests etc., its always their maiden name that's recorded.
Who knows perhaps her first husbands surname was Fusco the same as her maiden name?
Will do some searching tomorrow
Emmy
Even after a woman gets married, eg on ships manifests etc., its always their maiden name that's recorded.
Who knows perhaps her first husbands surname was Fusco the same as her maiden name?
Will do some searching tomorrow
Emmy
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Hi,
On birth registrations I have it always lists the mother's father's name and places fu before the father name, which I have always taken as meaning daughter of the deceased for eg in this case as Emmy suggests Gerttrude Fusco daughter of the deceased Domincantonio of St Elia.
But the St Elia does this mean where her father resided or died?
Mark
On birth registrations I have it always lists the mother's father's name and places fu before the father name, which I have always taken as meaning daughter of the deceased for eg in this case as Emmy suggests Gerttrude Fusco daughter of the deceased Domincantonio of St Elia.
But the St Elia does this mean where her father resided or died?
Mark
Searching for Palombella family in Molfetta, Puglia
Mark
Mark
Re: Risi and Fusco families
I was at the FHC this afternoon but no luck.
I checked the death records for the Christian name Domenicantonio/Domenico Antonio to make sure I didnt miss any record.
The names that did come up were not relevant
The Death record that I had posted before:
1st October 1863 Domenico Antonio Fusco age 28
Father -Geronimo Mother - Rosa Di ?
the other name that was on the record was Maria Miele I take it she was a relative who was a witness when the death was being recorded. She was defiantely not his wife.
The other record I found
7th May 1863 Domenico Antonio Fusco age 27 married Maria Di Mambro age 21
His father -Antonio His mother Orazia Nero
Her father - fu Silvestro Her Mother - fu Teresa Pacitto (both her parents were dead when the marriage took place)
I also checked the marriage film for any bride with the name 'Geltrude/ Geltrude Fusco' but no record for that .
The dates of the films I had- Marriage 1860-1879
Death -1860-1882
I was thinking if she was married for the 2nd time in 1873 maybe her 1st marriage was before 1860
And if Dominicantonio isnt her 1st husband but her father he could have died long before 1860?
I'd really like to find out for definate if he was her husband or her father
I've had the marriage films for 1851-1861 on order since May and the Death records for the same years have been on order since August I'm told because I've requested them on indefinate loan that it will take awhile for them to come
I'll still keep a look out for these names when I'm recording just in case I've missed something.
Now to try to post this- This is the 2nd time typing this, I lost it all the first time
Emmy
I checked the death records for the Christian name Domenicantonio/Domenico Antonio to make sure I didnt miss any record.
The names that did come up were not relevant
The Death record that I had posted before:
1st October 1863 Domenico Antonio Fusco age 28
Father -Geronimo Mother - Rosa Di ?
the other name that was on the record was Maria Miele I take it she was a relative who was a witness when the death was being recorded. She was defiantely not his wife.
The other record I found
7th May 1863 Domenico Antonio Fusco age 27 married Maria Di Mambro age 21
His father -Antonio His mother Orazia Nero
Her father - fu Silvestro Her Mother - fu Teresa Pacitto (both her parents were dead when the marriage took place)
I also checked the marriage film for any bride with the name 'Geltrude/ Geltrude Fusco' but no record for that .
The dates of the films I had- Marriage 1860-1879
Death -1860-1882
I was thinking if she was married for the 2nd time in 1873 maybe her 1st marriage was before 1860
And if Dominicantonio isnt her 1st husband but her father he could have died long before 1860?
I'd really like to find out for definate if he was her husband or her father
I've had the marriage films for 1851-1861 on order since May and the Death records for the same years have been on order since August I'm told because I've requested them on indefinate loan that it will take awhile for them to come
I'll still keep a look out for these names when I'm recording just in case I've missed something.
Now to try to post this- This is the 2nd time typing this, I lost it all the first time
Emmy
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Just a thought Paul
Cant remember if you said you had Gelrtudes birth act.
Any idea about what year she would have been born?
If we found her birth record it would give the name of her father- hopefully
I've got films for Births for the following years:-
1830-1837
1850-1857
1857-1865
and I've got 1822-1829 on order.
Emmy
Cant remember if you said you had Gelrtudes birth act.
Any idea about what year she would have been born?
If we found her birth record it would give the name of her father- hopefully
I've got films for Births for the following years:-
1830-1837
1850-1857
1857-1865
and I've got 1822-1829 on order.
Emmy
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Thanks yet again, Emmy, for your hard work. I agree, Geltrude's birth act probably holds the key to this puzzle. I didn't come across it in the Cassino records where I believed she was born, but of course she may well have been born in Sant'Elia.
I know speculation is dangerous, but why is it not possible that the Domenicantonio Fusco who died in 1863 was the father of Gertrulda? Would the death record always show that he was married at the time of death? Admittedly, he would have been very young to father a child if Gertrulda was c20/21 when she married in 1873 (18 in 1853), but it's not impossible. But if the death record would always show his wife's name then I guess it's very unlikely.
The name of Maria Miele intrigues me. I have come across this surname on English censuses: when Lorenzo Risi was living in Bradford, England in 1901 there was an Alessandro 'MEHL (?!)' (this is how it was written on the census so the enumerator was clearly not sure of the spelling) living with them with his wife Domenica (both born Italy) (PRO ref RG13/4148/72/17). In the same year, a Domenico Miele is one of the Italian ‘piano grinders’ shown as boarders at 29 North Street, Hull, home of Pasquale Antonio Risi and his wife (one of Lorenzo Risi's sons) (see PRO RG13/4498/104/11). So perhaps there was a connection with the families or is this just a coincidence arising from the fact that many santelians emigrated to UK about that time? Certainly I need some corroboration to be sure and I think Geltrude's birth record or her and Lorenzo's marriage record may have the answer.
PS: I lose my postings every time I hit the 'submit' button so I've got into the habit of highlighting and copying them first. Then I simply can paste and resubmit.
Paul
I know speculation is dangerous, but why is it not possible that the Domenicantonio Fusco who died in 1863 was the father of Gertrulda? Would the death record always show that he was married at the time of death? Admittedly, he would have been very young to father a child if Gertrulda was c20/21 when she married in 1873 (18 in 1853), but it's not impossible. But if the death record would always show his wife's name then I guess it's very unlikely.
The name of Maria Miele intrigues me. I have come across this surname on English censuses: when Lorenzo Risi was living in Bradford, England in 1901 there was an Alessandro 'MEHL (?!)' (this is how it was written on the census so the enumerator was clearly not sure of the spelling) living with them with his wife Domenica (both born Italy) (PRO ref RG13/4148/72/17). In the same year, a Domenico Miele is one of the Italian ‘piano grinders’ shown as boarders at 29 North Street, Hull, home of Pasquale Antonio Risi and his wife (one of Lorenzo Risi's sons) (see PRO RG13/4498/104/11). So perhaps there was a connection with the families or is this just a coincidence arising from the fact that many santelians emigrated to UK about that time? Certainly I need some corroboration to be sure and I think Geltrude's birth record or her and Lorenzo's marriage record may have the answer.
PS: I lose my postings every time I hit the 'submit' button so I've got into the habit of highlighting and copying them first. Then I simply can paste and resubmit.
Paul
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Hi Paul
I know age wise it would have been possible for that death record to link in with him being Gertude's father but I'm almost certain it's not him. I'm posting a death record I have to let you see how its recorded if the perosn who died had been married.
click to enlarge
The top part of the document is just giving information about when this record was recorded The Part ATTO DI MORTE gives the following information:-(I know you will probably understand the meaning but if I translate it may help someone else)
The year 1862 on 18th February died in Sant'Elia Fiumerapido D'Agostino Palma Rosa daughter of fu(means he was dead when his daughter died) Giacomo and of fuRizzi Caterina. born in Sant'Elia age
88 years di stato civile vedova di Bastianelli Giuseppe(widow of)
Sometimes I've found in this part of the record it said Moglie of ...... meaning wife of and marito of (husband of) so if that Domenicoangelo had been married I'm sure it would have been recorded at the end of the record .
(If this information is wrong then I wont be offended if someone corrects
it.)
Emmy
I know age wise it would have been possible for that death record to link in with him being Gertude's father but I'm almost certain it's not him. I'm posting a death record I have to let you see how its recorded if the perosn who died had been married.
click to enlargeThe top part of the document is just giving information about when this record was recorded The Part ATTO DI MORTE gives the following information:-(I know you will probably understand the meaning but if I translate it may help someone else)
The year 1862 on 18th February died in Sant'Elia Fiumerapido D'Agostino Palma Rosa daughter of fu(means he was dead when his daughter died) Giacomo and of fuRizzi Caterina. born in Sant'Elia age
88 years di stato civile vedova di Bastianelli Giuseppe(widow of)
Sometimes I've found in this part of the record it said Moglie of ...... meaning wife of and marito of (husband of) so if that Domenicoangelo had been married I'm sure it would have been recorded at the end of the record .
(If this information is wrong then I wont be offended if someone corrects
it.)
Emmy
Re: Risi and Fusco families
Paul when I was at the FHC today I looked up the index for births 1850-1854 no records at all for Fusco in those years. I'll check some more years next time I'm back. The Indexes for the birth records are not in alphabetical order so you need to look down the complete list (Index for death is in alphabetical order 
) Births have been recorded by date and month child was born (Odd though that not even one Fusco was born in 4 years? but checking the Fusco death's comparing the year they died and their age it seems that many of them would have been born before 1850 and I dont have that film)) Do you know what I never thought to check!!!- The children's mother's maiden names. Maybe very few sons were born to carry on the Fusco name - could perhaps be lots of female Fusco's I'll check this out 
but that still will not help with finding Geltruda because her father would have been Fusco ?
Emmy
I know this will not be relevant to your search but this came up in the death records:-
Arpino Angela died 26 June 1861 age 1 year
Father: Giuseppe
Mother: Maria Antonia Fusco
Emmy
) Births have been recorded by date and month child was born (Odd though that not even one Fusco was born in 4 years? but checking the Fusco death's comparing the year they died and their age it seems that many of them would have been born before 1850 and I dont have that film)) Do you know what I never thought to check!!!- The children's mother's maiden names. Maybe very few sons were born to carry on the Fusco name - could perhaps be lots of female Fusco's I'll check this out but that still will not help with finding Geltruda because her father would have been Fusco ? Emmy
I know this will not be relevant to your search but this came up in the death records:-
Arpino Angela died 26 June 1861 age 1 year
Father: Giuseppe
Mother: Maria Antonia Fusco
Emmy
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BillieDeKid
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Re: Risi and Fusco families
Hi Em,
Been following the thread. Interesting stuff. One thing I've come across in my searches with the films - the indexes don't always have all of the documents listed. I've found birth, death and marriage records on the films and they were not listed on the indexes for some of the years.
Just wanted to pass that along so you don't miss something in your search of the films.
Elizabeth
Been following the thread. Interesting stuff. One thing I've come across in my searches with the films - the indexes don't always have all of the documents listed. I've found birth, death and marriage records on the films and they were not listed on the indexes for some of the years.
Just wanted to pass that along so you don't miss something in your search of the films.
Elizabeth
