Birthrecords of my Grandparents

[FrankCMauro]

Hi,
I am trying to find the birth certificates of my grandmother and grandfather, I have the following information:

Grandfather: James Vito Caligure
Birth Date: 3 November 1893
Place of Birth: Stronglio, Catanzaro, Italy

Grandmother: Lena Cascio
Birth Date: 23 September 1899
Place of Birth: Corsica, Sicily

Thank you for any help you can give me.
Sincerely,
Frank C. Mauro

[mmogno]

Maybe the town is Strongoli (Crotone) and the surname Caligiuri. Unfortunately the Birth Records of Strongoli for the year 1893 are not online.

In Italy there is no municipality named Corsica.
The surname Cascio is widespread throughout Sicily.
https://www.cognomix.it/mappe-dei-cogno ... IO/SICILIA

[suanj]

copy and paste the marriage record:
Name Vito Cahguiri
Sex Male
Age 22
Birth Year (Estimated) 1893
Birthplace Italy
Race White
Father's Name Georgio
Father's Sex Male
Mother's Name Maria Lucenta
Mother's Sex Female
Spouse's Name Lena Cassio
Spouse's Sex Female
Spouse's Age 17
Spouse's Birth Year (Estimated) 1898
Spouse's Birthplace Italy
Spouse's Race White
Spouse's Father's Name Antonio
Spouse's Father's Sex Male
Spouse's Mother's Name Anna Nocura (no: RAGUSA)
Marriage Date 12 Dec 1915
Marriage Place Manhattan, New York City, New York, United States
Marriage Place (Original) Manhattan, New York
Event Type Marriage
Source Details cn 28113
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:24QZ-XF5

On 1910 census, Vito, his real birth name, was in S. Joseph Institute and declares the his immigration on 1895
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903 ... cc=1727033
Collecting some other info, always helpful...

On 1905 census, Brooklyn, Kings, New York Vito lived in the family:
Name Vite Caligini (CALIGIURI)
Sex Male
Age 12y
Event Date 1905
Event Place Brooklyn, A.D. 04, E.D. 28, Kings, New York
Event Type CENSUS
Race W
Relationship to Head of Household Son
Birth Year (Estimated) 1893
Birth Year (Estimated) 1893
Birthplace Italy
Digital Folder Number 004296310
Image Number 645
Record Number 60752
Record Number 60752
Vite Caligini's Parents and Siblings
Giacin* Caligini
Father
M
44y
Italy
Name Giacin* Caligini
Sex Male
Age 44y
Event Date 1905
Event Place Brooklyn, A.D. 04, E.D. 28, Kings, New York
Event Type CENSUS
Race W
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Birth Year (Estimated) 1861
Birth Year (Estimated) 1861
Birthplace Italy
Digital Folder Number 004296310
Image Number 645
Record Number 60747
Record Number 60747
Mary Caligini
Mother
F
50y
Italy
Donenica Caligini
Sister
F
16y
Italy
Joseph Caligini
Brother
M
14y
Italy
Michiel Caligini
Brother
M
12y
Italy
Katie Caligini
Sister
F
9y
Italy
So the italian name of his father was Giacinto.. and the mother I believe her ful name Maria Benedetta Teresa LUCENTE born on 20 may 1854 #41 in Strongoli https://www.antenati.san.beniculturali. ... 90/0A4b199.
So knowing the parent's nmes I believe more easy to ask the birth certificate in Strongoli.


Abt Lena:
Lena was born in USA no in Italy, her parent's were Antonino CASCIO and Anna RAGUSA ( no Nocura by bad transcription). The family went from CORLEONE, Palermo, IT

Name Antonio Cascia
Sex Male
Age 35y
Event Date 1905
Event Place Manhattan, A.D. 32, E.D. 21, New York, New York
Event Type CENSUS
Race W
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Birth Year (Estimated) 1870
Birth Year (Estimated) 1870
Birthplace Italy
Digital Folder Number 004518330
Image Number 247
Record Number 24044
Record Number 24044
Antonio Cascia's Spouses and Children
Anna Cascia
Wife
F
30y
Italy
Joseph Cascia
Son
M
10y
Italy
Fannie Cascia
Daughter
F
8y
Italy
Lena Cascia
Daughter
F
7y
United States
Tomaso Cascia
Son
M
6y
United States
Rosalia Cascia
Daughter
F
4y
United States
Salvator Cascia
Son
M
2y
United States
Maria Cascia
Daughter
F
0y
United States


the arrival on 1898

https://heritage.statueofliberty.org/sh ... cGciOw==/1

Antonino Cascio was born in Corleone on 21 Dec 1870 son of Giuseppe Cascio and Serafina Vitale
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903 ... cc=2051639

For bad luck the civil records online ending on 1895, but it could be helful to search in the New York birth before, because I believe she was born in New York....
regards,
suanj

[FrankCMauro]

Thank you for your help suanj, very much appreciated.
Sincerely,
Frank

[parkergambino]

Here is the link to the NYC marriage license image for Vito Caligure & Lena Cascio: https://a860-historicalvitalrecords.nyc ... ew/8601376

where Lena's birthplace is said to be Italy. On this document I read Lena's mother's maiden name as "Anna Rocusa". Her father's name is recorded as Antonio (not "Antonino").

So there is conflicting information about Lena's birthplace. I do not find her among Ellis Island immigrants (supporting birth in the USA), but neither do I find her older brother Joseph (Giuseppe?) among Ellis Island immigrants, and he is listed in the 1905 census as being born in Italy, as is his sister "Fannie", which seems like the nickname given to Maria, who we DO find among Ellis Island immigrants - she crossed with her parents (the Scindia arrived on February 21, not February 11, 1898).

Gary Ridolph has done extensive work with Corleone lineages, and may be able to help, but I do not know his user name. If you send me a PM I will try to put you in touch with him.

Parker

[parkergambino]

Frank,

Oops, I hope I haven't made things more confusing, or moreso in going forward. I do not have direct access to the 1905 census - perhaps Suanj can provide a link - and for my previous comment I did not look all the way through the posted data. There are some name/age discrepancies between that census and the Scindia manifest. We can safely assume that the parents match up well. The one child accompanying them on Scindia, Maria Cascia, does not have her age listed. Perhaps under 1 year old?

The usual arithmetic approximations of birth dates inferred from ages recorded on the 1905 census are given below

Two children born in Italy:
Joseph 10 (~1895)
Fannie 8 (~1897)
These correspond well with the parents still being in Sicily prior to crossing in 1898. However, I have not found either of these children, using those names, in the Ellis Island records.

The remaining 5 children are born in USA:
Lena 7 (~1898)
Tomaso 6 (~1899)
Rosalia 4 (~1901)
Salvator 2 (~1903)
MARIA 0 (~1905)

So, there is a Maria born in the USA, and a Maria who crossed with parents in 1898. Using the dates, I had assumed that Fannie might be another name for Maria. But this doesn't jibe with there being the young Maria listed on the census.

Sorry, this doesn't resolve the issue; all it does is make one a bit suspicious about the degree of trust that can be put in this particular census sheet.

Maybe we can find them on the 1900 census?

Parker

[parkergambino]

No luck here on the 1900 census
Here is the 1910 census:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903 ... 3AM5ZC-6PD with a few name variants (Fannie is Frances, Salvatore is Sam), and even more evidence of Lena's birth in NYC.

This link is to several of the family marriages in NYC:
https://a860-historicalvitalrecords.nyc ... 49&county=

Salvatore and Maria, born in New York, match up well with the 1905 census.
Serafina, born in Italy, matches with Fannie on the 1905 census.
The mystery of Maria crossing in 1898 remains. Perhaps died in NY?

Note that the surname is indexed as "Cassio"; perhaps helpful in additional searches. I'm bowing out on this for now.

Parker

[suanj]

Hi abt some discrepancy no problem, it is the right family, surely.. here the 1905 census



I believe Anna Ragusa was pregnant of Lena... the first two children had the names of Antonino parents, (Fannie/anglicized diminutive of Serafina), so needs to understand if Lena was the anglicized diminutive of Carmelina, or Angelina ossomething like so..
suanj

[suanj]

Here the marriage: Corleone 22 Jan 1895 #5
Gromm: Antonino CASCIO, 24 old, single, pasta maker profession, born and residing in Corleone, son of Giuseppe and of late Serafina Vitale.
BRIDE: Anna RAGUSA, single, 19 old, housewife profession, born in Castronovo, residing in Corleone, daughter of late Gaetano and of Antonina Provenzano
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903 ... cc=2051639
suanj

[parkergambino]

Crumbs:

First childen named for Cascio parents, yes.
Later children named for the Ragusa parents (Gaetano & Antonina)?
Tomaso, Tom = Gaetano, Lena = Antonina?

Destination on the Scindia: Marianna Provenzano, but the address is not clear or easily searchable

The 1910 census shows daughter Frances arriving in the same year ("1897") as her parents; perhaps the wrong name is mistakenly on the Scindia manifest, and "Maria Cascio" is actually Serafina.

Parker

[suanj]

We agree that the names of the other children do not correspond to those of Anna's parents, but the duty to follow the naming tradition was not always respected by Italian immigrants in the USA especially. "Far from eyes, far from heart"!
If the other children had been born in Italy they would have been more likely to be named after their maternal grandparents. It was a matter of custom, tradition, and repeat and sometimes of interest, because if grandparents whose name was not given to their grandchildren, he could treat them less favorably and please don't think it was a rare behavior.

On the contrary. In this way of doing machismo was part of it, always considering the woman as a person of the second series. For example, speaking from personal experience, I bear the first name of my paternal grandfather, obviously feminine. When my brother was born, he had the same name as me, masculine. A sister of mine is named after my paternal grandmother. Another sister the female name of my maternal grandfather.

Not from my maternal grandmother. Well when we went to visit our maternal grandparents, I never met my paternal ones as they died young, we were the their disliked grandchildren. First of all we were their daughter's children and therefore we didn't bear their surname, obviously, but that of our father, secondly, even first names didn't help us. My mother, despite the fact that 3 girls were born to her, didn't name anyone after her own mother, because they didn't get along.
This was between the 50s and 60s. So let alone the past. We were frowned upon by our maternal grandparents. I don't remember a caress, a kiss, a kind word from my maternal grandparents. They said we weren't their grandchildren because we had another surname! While their children's children were always welcome. A very bad discrimination made against children who in any case were of their own blood.

So the naming tradition was valid when and depending on there were no difficult relationships. It was a rule that was followed as a custom, but first of all , it don't was not only the respect of children for their parents, but also vice versa, the respect of parents for their children.

[suanj]

Another thing, is that on 1905 Joseph and Fannie stated that were in USA from 4 years.. 4years?
https://i.postimg.cc/c18Zv64Q/004518330-00247.jpg

[suanj]

I found these birth records:

Name Antonia Casso
Sex Female
Birth Date 06 Sep 1898
Birthplace Manhattan, New York, New York, United States
Birthplace (Original) Manhattan, New York
Race White
Father's Name Antonio Casso
Father's Age 26
Father's Birthplace Italy
Mother's Name Anna Ragusa
Mother's Age 24
Mother's Birthplace Italy
Event Type Birth

----------------------------------------
Name Gaetano Cascano
Sex Male
Birth Date 05 Jan 1901
Birthplace Manhattan, New York, New York, United States
Birthplace (Original) Manhattan, New York
Race White
Father's Name Antonino
Father's Age 31
Father's Birthplace Italy
Mother's Name Anna Ragusa
Mother's Age 26
Mother's Birthplace Italy
Event Type Birth
-----------------------------------------------
the bad transcription of surname, so: Anna Ragusa followed naming tradition: Antonia and Gaetano.
they are the children of the couple, so Antonia was Lena, born in 1898, since in the 1905 census she is 7 years old, and Gaetano corresponds to Tomaso. Just used other first name on the censuses.....


(PS: the first names Antonino male and Antonina female are no the same of Antonio and Antonia, the firsts are abt a S. Antonino, the seconds abt S. Antonio of Padua. But however Antonino and Antonina are classified like Antonio and Antonia. These first names, male and female are used especially in Sicily).
suanj

[FrankCMauro]

Hi suanj,
Thank you for your help.
Another situation arose, my daughter is presently pregnant with twins.
I was told by my wife that her grandfather James Vito Caligure, and his brother Michael were twins. You had established from your research and the 1905 NYS Census that Vito and his brother Michael were both 12 years old.
Is there any way I can establish that they are in fact twins?
Your help as always is appreciated.
Sincerely,
Frank

[suanj]

sorry nothing on line abt the civil records of 1893. The only way is to search the WWI draft registration cards of both brothers and to see if the bitthdate is the same..
Regards,
suanj