Roccaforte- francesco Paolo or francesca

[lindamauer]

Hello,
This record is on the fee based Archidiocese of Agrigento
If anyone has access to this site Please help with translation.
Since it is copyrighted i will only state that the record is Montevago birth image 85 located on folio 84 - recto bottom looks like September 19, 1808
Francesco Paolo maybe but also the mother's name seems spelled differently Lommardo for which i have her name as Lombardo- what is the usual spelling in this town
Thanks
Linda

[erudita74]

Linda

Baptism on Sept 19, 1808, Francesca (Roccaforte) was born yesterday (18th) to Antonino Roccaforte and Maria Lombardo, spouses. Godparents were Don* (title) Francesco Paolo Giuffrida and Caterina Ingoglia, spouses.

Erudita

[mmogno]

Die 19 ejusdem [= 19 September 1808]
Francisca heri nata ex Antonino Roccaforte et Maria Lommardo jug(ali)bus bap(tiza)ta fuit [a] me Sac(erdote) Vito Cajesi de lic(enzi)a. PP (= Patrini) fuere d(on) Franciscus Paolus Giuffrida et Caterina Ingoglia jug(a)les.

[lindamauer]

Thanks Erudita,

thanks mmgno- any thoughts on Lommardo versus Lombardo- misspelling?

[erudita74]

Linda

I know you’ve directed the question about Lommardo vs Lombardo to mmogno and not to me, but I know we’ve seen evidence in other Sicilian church records in which the double m in a surname was later mb in the surname. Giammalvo vs Giambalvo, for example. I don’t know Sicilian or regional dialects, but my best guess is that the spelling in the church records had to do with how the surname was pronounced by the parties involved. So if the surname was pronounced like it had the sound m vs mb, then the spelling in the record reflected the pronunciation. I think in later records for this same family, you will probably find the surname as Lombardo and not Lommardo as it is spelled in this church record. Maybe mmogno has some other thoughts on this issue. It’s unfortunate that the marriage records for the time period in question are missing, as then we might have gotten a clue as to what area of Sicily, the Lommardo surname in this town may have originated. I noticed on family search, for example, that there is a family tree where the spelling changed in a town in Caltasinetta, Sicily, but that could prove to be a wild goose chase for you.

Erudita

[mmogno]

@erudita74
La versione corretta del cognome è sicuramente Lombardo, data l'etimologia (Lombardo, Longobardo è riferito a una persona che proveniva dal Nord, zone soggette al dominio Longobardo, diversamente dalla Sicilia). Il cognome attualmente è il quarto più frequente in Sicilia.
Ma la pronuncia popolare era simile a Lommardo e questa variante è stata usata anche in alcuni atti della Chiesa. Ora è però estinta.

[erudita74]

Yes, the surname Lombardo does have geographical roots in the northern region, as do the people who bear it. And it is among the most frequent surnames found in Sicily. Interesting though is that Professor Joseph G Fucilla, in his book Our Italian Surnames, also refers to it as an occupational surname. He claims that, in Sicilian dialect, Lombardo translates to “shopkeeper,” and that many with that surname do or did have that occupation. Of course, to determine the validity of his claim, one would have to turn to the Sicilian civil records which did not begin before 1820/21.

I also quickly looked through some of the baptism records for infants born around the same time as Francesca Roccaforte and found a male infant named Paolo Lombardo born in January of 1810. Of course, this one record does not prove that, by that year, the spelling of the surname had changed from Lommardo to Lombardo.

One other interesting thing I found relates to something Linda posted in another thread regarding Francesca’s mother’s name. She wrote her name as Maria Perniciaro Lombardo. I did find an 1825 marriage for a Calogero Lombardo (folio 232). He was the son of a deceased Giuseppe Lombardo and an Anna Perniciaro. So possibly he was a younger brother of Maria and his parents were the same as hers???

Erudita

[lindamauer]

how very extensively interesting mmgno and Erudita.
Yes i have added Calogero to the family.
i also have strong confidence that Lombardo is the best to choose.
I know things will be close and that is ok with me
Best
Linda