baldassare cicio e vita sortino

[lindamauer]

Hello,

record is on archdiocese agrigento paid site- folio 559 verso image 563
left side
2nd record down
november 8 1835
Please translate for any additional information
Thanks
Linda

[erudita74]

Linda

You forgot to say this record is from Sambuca, but I tracked it down.

Dated Nov 8, 1835.

Groom: Baldassare Cicio. He was never before married, of this town of Sambuca. He was the legitimate and natural son of Baldassare Cicio and Crocifissa Romano, a married couple.

Bride: Vita Sortino, never before married, of this town, legitimate and natural daughter of deceased Giuseppe Sortino and living Margherita Cipolla, former spouses.

Witnesses were Gaspare Ferrara and Georgia d’Omara (?)

Banns on Sept 20 and 27, and 4th of Oct, resulted in no impediments to the marriage.

Erudita

[lindamauer]

Hello Erudita,
So sorry for the trouble.
Thank you for the translation. i will look for the banns to see if there are any ages given.
Best,
Linda

[mmogno]

#53
Solemn Promise on 6 October 1835. Marriage on October 8th.
https://antenati.cultura.gov.it/ark:/12 ... 45/wWoGxlX

Groom: Baldassare Cicio, aged 22, son of Baldassare Cicio (60) and Crocifissa Romano (55).
Bride: Vita Maria Sortino, aged 20, daughter of deceased Giuseppe Sortino and Margherita Cipolla (50).

Processetti
https://antenati.cultura.gov.it/ark:/12 ... 29/wkm9zqQ

[lindamauer]

thanks mmgno!
Best,
Linda

[erudita74]

@mmogno

I find it very strange that the civil record indicates the month of October for the marriage taking place in the parish, as the Latin word for November is clearly written out on the actual church record (8 Novembris 1835). Folio 559

Erudita

[lindamauer]

Erudita,
I asked the same question.
I was told this scenario as a possible explanation of cultural practices.
A civil marriage was not recognized legally when it comes to inheritance.
A church marriage is recognized for inheritance, hence the need to have 2 marriages one civil then another in church.
I hope i stated that correctly.
Anyway I accept that as it sounds feasible.
Best
Linda

[erudita74]

Linda

The inheritance issue does not apply to an 1835 church marriage. It only applies to church marriages which took place after the unification of Italy in 1865 or so.

Since notification of the marriage was posted on the door of the town hall on Sept 13th, the last bann in the church was announced on Oct 4th, and the priest or his cleric returned to the civil office one copy of the record with the right column he or his cleric filled in on the 20th, then I believe the Nov date in the parish register is incorrect, and that the Oct 8th date he recorded in the rgt column of the civil record is correct. Sometimes parish events were not recorded in the parish registers immediately after they took place, so errors may have been made.

Erudita

[lindamauer]

Hello Erudita,
Thanks for your clarity and understanding
Best,
Linda

[mmogno]

Linda

The inheritance issue does not apply to an 1835 church marriage. It only applies to church marriages which took place after the unification of Italy in 1865 or so.

Since notification of the marriage was posted on the door of the town hall on Sept 13th, the last bann in the church was announced on Oct 4th, and the priest or his cleric returned to the civil office one copy of the record with the right column he or his cleric filled in on the 20th, then I believe the Nov date in the parish register is incorrect, and that the Oct 8th date he recorded in the rgt column of the civil record is correct. Sometimes parish events were not recorded in the parish registers immediately after they took place, so errors may have been made.

Erudita

@erudita74
Concordo. Nelle pagine precedenti a quella del matrimonio Cicio-Sortino sul registro parrocchiale è registrato un matrimonio datato 27 Novembre in mezzo ad altri di Ottobre. E' chiaramente un errore di trascrizione.

@lindamauer
In fact, the opposite is true for the period from the unification of Italy up to the Concordat between the Kingdom of Italy and the Holy See in 1929.
A church marriage was not recognized legally.

[erudita74]

@mmogno

ho veduto il matrimonio datato 27 Nov in mezzo ad altri di Ottobre - chiaramente un errore. Sono d’accordo.

Erudita

[lindamauer]

Hello Erudita,
Thank you for the clarity.
I mentioned in my reply my concern that i had it backwards. I do that when i rely on my mind sometimes.
i will notate event as october 8th
Best
Linda